Saturday, December 08, 2007
Amanda Baggs, LSD Psychosis or Autism?
Having watched a person who is really autistic every day for the last 11 years, I can state that this knucklehead has nothing in common with autistic people. When autistic children want something to eat or drink, they know which cabinet to go to and they grab what they want without getting lost in the process.
This video has nothing in common with autism.
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61 comments:
Autism. If that's the choice cause that ain't LSD psychosis!
To be clear, I think Best is harsh... but these people! They have nothing in common with the LFAs (or HFAs) in my life. NOTHING. NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING. LFAs don't post you tube videos detailing their lives and blogging left and right... oh right, Amanda doesn't want a LABEL. Well then go away from AUTISM. Because you are not autistic. Sure, you are something, you are disabled, you qualify for something, but YOU ARE NOT AUTISTIC.
THE end.
Now that we've seen Amanda do a very poor job of imitating an autistic person.
Put up a video of the real thing so that those with even an untraind eye can see just what a fraud Amanda is. Then send both films to CNN so they can learn the difference.
Videos say very little without a proper medical opinion. Let's hear from a real doctor - not a bunch of amateur wannabe "experts".
So ok, you think you know what an autistic looks like. What's your qualification to diagnose LSD psychosis? I'd trust you to know what a personality disorder is...
Zarathustra,
LSD psychosis is extremely rare. Most people don't suffer long lasting effects. Most LSD users don't use it 4 or 5 times a day either, coupled with magic mushrooms.
The way Baggs presents herself in this video, the most logical conclusions about her would be to guess brain damage or Alzheimer's. People with those diagnoses may forget things or may not be intelligent enough to remember anything or to learn how to accomplish simple tasks.
This does not match up with her writing ability or her Youtube video making ability. I think the lack of "flapping" is also noteworthy. She's not flapping in this video yet she claims it is uncontrollable. Perhaps "flapping" was not in the script for this particular role.
1st anon,
You may think I'm harsh but should I be nice to frauds who misrepresent the nightmare that was inflicted on my son.
Every person who was diagnosed with autism as an adult gives a misrepresentation of what it's like to endure life without being able to talk, write, read and use a toilet. These people did not grow up with those disabilities or they would have been diagnosed as children. That misrepresentation detracts from exposing the true horror of autism and makes it less likely that public opinion will force our bribed politicains to admit the truth about thimerosal and support research that might actually cure them.
The way I see it, one can not be harsh enough in putting scumbags like Baggs, Estee Klar, Frank Klein, Seidel and others in their place.
This looks completely scripted and staged. Typically once autistics learn a routine (such as how to prepare something in the kitchen) all of the steps are very automatic. This looks nothing like ANY autistic person that I have ever witnessed going through a routine that they have done many times. Plus, where are all her stims such as hand flapping that she speaks of?
Mr. Best
I do not agree with you on everything autistic but I have some trouble accepting this video as a realistic depiction of autistic behavior.
My son was diagnosed as severely autistic by two pediatricians with backgrounds in autism and a clinical psychologist and retired psychology Professor who has specialized in autism.
Ms. Baggs behavior is not even remotely similar to what I have observed and experienced in almost 12 years of 24/7 interaction with a severely autistic child.
1) My son is much more aware of his environment than the persons in this video appears to be. In the middle of the night I have seen him go to the bathroom, still disoriented to use the toilet, and as he passes the sink, flip a hairbrush so that the bristles face down instead of up, as he expects them to be. I have seen him do that more than once. By contrast, the person in the video appears confused about where to find things in relation to objects that she herself uses every day.
2) Much of the behavior in the video suggests that she has no routine to effectively accomplish her task. My son by contrast can start a household computer, go quickly to his folder of bookmarks, find a bookmark for PBS Kids and manipulate the mouse very effectively. Once he learns or uses a routine he is actually good at retaining it. This person looks like she is starting from scratch to perform a task she performs daily.
There are other subtler points I could reference but do not have time and they would be harder to explain.
I am not a doctor and while I have doubts about Ms Baggs diagosis based only on parental experience I can not challenge it. This video though is intended to form part of the public discourse about autism and autism realities. I do not think her behavior in this video reflects the behavior of an autistic person. At least it is nothing remotely similar to the behavior demonstrated over 12 years by my severely autistic son.
Harold Doherty
Fredericton New Brunswick
Canada
Interesting.
If I had to hazard a guess at what I am watching I would say that it were an extreme case of obsessive compulsive disorder.
I have witnessed behaviors like that in autistic adults, but generally as the result of the comorbidity of OCD.
Amanda Baggs does not appear to have OCD when it comes to eating. She has posted blogs about her ability to cook. She posted pictures of a huge cake she says she baked herself. How could she do that if it takes her 5 hours to boil water. How could she get to her appointments. Does it take her 3 hours to find her computer to blog? She seems to have no difficulty doing the things she wants to do like producing endless videos, blogging daily, going to conferences in other countries, doing interviews. Yet it takes her 5 hours to boil a kettle and apparently just getting up off the couch is a serious and complex procedure for her.
There is no consistency in her abilities or lack of abilities. I do not believe she has anything at all wrong with her. She is a fake from start to finish.
Why don't the people who supposedly support her help her address her apparent endocrine disorder? I think that looks like her biggest problem.
After watching this video how do people(such as Estee Klar and others) believe this person? And is that what Estee wants her son to be like?
If this video actually does portray reality for Amanda, someone needs to call social services. She should not live alone nor ever be left alone! How will she ever figure out how to turn off the stove. If it takes another five hours, she and all of the tenents in her building are in serious danger from an impending fire!
Estee Klar doesn't care what happens to her son as long as she gets to be on TV
Or pose with pictures of Lance Armstrong. When does Estee find time for her son?
HAROLD,
I worked in an institution with adult autistics who were severely disabled and none of them acted as retarded as Baggs.
Do you think Estee gave Lance some head in the back room?
Is her blog really about autism or about getting attention to feed her ego? She looks like his mother in that picture.
That's because you haven't seen ALL varieties of Autism, Best! That is an Autistic person in the video. The repetitive behaviour, the rocking, the stimming (watch the fingers on her right hand - I'm willing to bet that's what she does to stop her arms flapping so she can actually pick things up without throwing them around) - clearly unable to focus without an effort.
You've got a lot to learn as always, Best. Each Autistic person is unique in their own way.
There is no consistency in her abilities or lack of abilities.
There never is in an Autistic person, anon. It's all over the place across the Spectrum, unless you concentrate on a certain small aspect.
Ms. Baggs behavior is not even remotely similar to what I have observed and experienced in almost 12 years of 24/7 interaction with a severely autistic child.
You're as bad as Best, Doherty. One person does not make a proper experience of Autism. Not even one location makes a proper experience (as is the case with Best).
These people did not grow up with those disabilities or they would have been diagnosed as children.
In the case of LFA's, Best - they were DXed with mental retardation or special learning disability if they weren't DXed with Autism. HFA's and Aspies (and I can personally attest to the latter) were missed completely because the diagnostic criteria wasn't there - so missed DX's or wrong DX's were common place. Especially with Aspergers as that wasn't even known in the medical world until the late 1980's!!
As always, Best (and the sock puppets plus Doherty) has no idea. Typical! The only sense came from "George" and Zarathustra - and me once this post gets through.
Well I would suppose that posting on your blog is a sign of lunacy never mind apostasy but here goes.
I'm not going to argue about Amanda, that is her job.
I will argue about your interpretation of autism however, classic autism or Kanner's autism call it what you will. It would do well to refresh your aquaintance with Dr Kanners original paper and the history of his patients, you will find something very different from the LFA autism you describe.
Autism is a category or description, and within that there are many mansions. There has not been consistency in the describing of it, some traits have gone in and out.
But if you look at another seemingly unassailable medical definition like Arthritis (and I am repeating myself here) you will see if you study medicine a bit more that Arthritis only describes inflamation of the joints and not the various etiologies and subtypes.
When I say I am autistic, I am using the word in a very different sence to what you mean by it.
But one thing you can't accuse me of is ignorance.
I don't pretend it is all the same, but I bloody well care about the whole spectrum and that is a point I make time and again at meetings.
Stephen Shore has said that if you have met one autistic person you have met one autistic person, you simply cannot generalise.
You can lable me with what you like, it does not change one iota what I actually am, which is a unique human being with a God given right to be on the planet.
There is a freaky picture of me standing next to Temple Grandin somewhere in the bowells of my website now, I cannot say who is more surprised by that. However what do you think of Temple Grandin, and what does she think of Amanda (I didn't ask)
I know what she thinks of me. I am rude but then so are you, and at least I am refraining from profanities on this occasion
Laurentius,
I don't argue that there are not different manifestations of autism.
None of those manifestations however, include normal children becoming autistic several years after blowing their brains out with LSD as Baggs did. She may have brain damage but she does not have autism of any sort.
Timelord(Phil Gluyas),
You aren't autistic either. You're just an imbecile who got a diagnosis as an excuse to avoid working.
Uh uh, Best. WRONG! As usual!
Unlike a lot of self DXed Aspies, I have a FORMAL DX - and four confirmations. All from qualified people. It's not an excuse not to work. It's the CMO's fault I'm not working - not mine.
I make the same challenge to you that I made to your sock puppets on another thread. Instead of making fun of the situation - how about helping? And not the way you think because that won't make a scrap of difference....Oh no of course you won't, because I'll go ahead and prove ASD's have positives. So you'd prefer it if I remained unemployed so my situation would remain as negative as you need it to be for your own purposes.
In other words - I scare the cow manure out of you!
Neither timelord nor Laurentius offered any serious comment on this subject.
It is interesting though how they are OK with generalizations about autism when they are making the generalizations or when a very high functioning autistic person is making the generalizations.
Harold,
You're a lawyer, do you have any comment about Anne B trying Baggs' case in public?
Phil's insane so you can safely ignore him.
Amanda has posted a picture on her blog which she claims is her mother. I think we can set aside any comcerns about Amanda weight being medical. It is clearly hereditory.
I wonder if Mom would tell us what Amanda was like before LSD>
Likely she'll slap the taste out of your mouth, Forearm!
I think I offered very serious comment on the subject, I urged people to read Kanners work again before deciding on what they call Kanners Autism.
Lets not forget either that he considered it an infantile psychosis, not a neurological or a biological disorder when he adopted Bleulers term "autism"
Of course a lot has changed since Kanner, in every field of medicine and science.
Right up until the 70's autism was still being called a psychosis and the research community was far from clear as to what differentiated it from Schizophrenia.
Most of the differentiations and codes that are in the current DSM were simply not around in my childhood or in my parents day and the average family doctor would not have any idea of what it was or even agreed that it existed.
Who before the war, who could not afford to would take a child to a psychiatrist to be diagnosed with anything when the likelihood was that they be locked away for ever to the families shame, it was a world few of us would recognise. That was the world of my parents and grandparents.
Reality check,
Are you kidding? Imagine what it must have been like for Mom putting up with a drug crazed kid. She'd probably love to talk about it.
Larry,
We haven't heard anything from Kev Leitch for awhile. Do you think he could have slipped from bipolar into full fledged autism? I mean, if Amanda could go from becoming an elf to becoming autistic, it's possible, isn't it?
I have my own criticisms of Amanda Baggs, however she isn't faking.
I went to school with several who were diagnosed with autism from the start. She has everything in common with them.
You're just delusional. And possibly an undiagnosed schizophrenic.
Anon,
You missed the point. Baggs may seem similar to autistics but she was a normal kid. She's also overacting. Nobody is a dumb as she acts in this video.
Well, now it is also the case that autism has generally been described as one of the most frustratingly heterogeneous conditions ever documented by the human species.
SPEAKING of documentation - does anyone have anything substantive on or by Amanda prior to the "elf" posting of 1997?
That is the furthest thing from autistic behavior that I have ever seen. She can't even perseverate correctly. And like Best said, autistics usually have the how, where and what they want memorized, (esp. if they are non-verbal) so they just go and get it.
Baggs demonstrates two things in this video; poor fluid intelligence and presumably high rote intelligence. That would be fine if this video was made 20+ years ago. We know more now.
Fraud, at least as far as being an autistic. Not so much otherwise, as there clearly is something wrong with her.
"Are you kidding? Imagine what it must have been like for Mom putting up with a drug crazed kid. She'd probably love to talk about it."
Are you kidding? She won't talk to you! She'll smack you one! For that shit alone!
RC,
If Mom's a decent person, she'll apologize for her daughter, give the kid a slap and tell her to admit the truth on CNN.
Actually I just recalibrated some of my searches and found some stuff Amanda posted going all the way back to 1993!
I'm telling you ... I think it might take a small army to make much sense at all out of all the twists and turns she has gone through.
What would your wife do if she was confronted with Kevin Leitch?
Oh... my.
That doesn't look like any autistic behavior I've seen. I'm not trying to "hate on" Amanda as I don't know her apart from what I've read online, but I will say this.
I have Asperger's, I've never done anything like that. It doesn't take me 5 hours to boil water, esp. because lots of things *are* routine for me. If I've done something enough times, I don't really forget it.
I've been in the home of an LFA child (friend of a parent) and when he was hungry he knew how to get to the kitchen and knew what cupboard the food was in, first try.
Furthermore, if she *has* done LSD I would dare say she's not at all autistic, whether LFA or HFA. In my Asperger's experience (which is not the same as LFA), even though I saw my schoolmates using drugs (among other things) in high school, I thank God it never occurred to me to ask them how to get the drugs, and when I did some critical thinking about the side effects of drugs, I didn't really find the idea of using to be "cool" either. It seemed illogical and stupid.
The majority of Aspies I know have never used drugs, for the same reasons: the socialization required to "score", and being rational about side effects. I don't think someone with LFA would be capable of acquiring drugs either, let alone something "hardcore" like LSD, which can do a lot of brain damage from even being used once.
I don't really know what is going on with Amanda since again, I don't know her personally, but from her own YouTube post, it doesn't look good. Yikes.
RC,
My wife would probably just laugh at Leitch.
My HF aspie partner has been known to smoke marajuana to calm him down. I think it is a good thing as it makes him less rigid and lessens the overload and anxiety many aspies have. But serious drugs? He would not touch them for all the reasons Mrs Spock mentions.
Speaking of Startrek I used to call him Data because his responses are so much like Data the android.
LSD, autism or psychosis?
None of the above! She's acting pure and simple.
Mrs. Axinar has been practically BEGGING me to take up a weed habit for YEARS ... :)
One persom wrote anonymously to ask me to remove a comment. Since I don't know who you are, you can remove it yourself by clicking on the trash can located on the bottom left of your comment.
"My wife would probably just laugh at Leitch."
Which goes to show she isn't a truly caring mother who would do anything to protect her son.
If she truly cared - she'd slap him.
Just like Amanda's mother would slap you.
Hey Reality Check stop insulting John's wife and Sam's Mother.
Want to insult John? Go for it! He can handle it and he makes no attempt not to draw insults from those that disagree with him, and is happy to give back in kind.
Leave his wife and kid out of it.
Oh and before you ask who the hell am I, my name is not a nickname like yours. I am not a supporter of many of John's opinions and I am on the spectrum myself (diagnosed).
You just insulted someone who has never said or done anything against you or in any way upset anyone here or as far as I know on any blog.
You have proven yourself an unredeemable arsehole. Well done. I had no opinion one way or another prior to the comment. Watch your integrity and morality race out the door hand in hand.
I just deleted a crazed rant from "Reality Check". Is that one of Phil's alter egos?
Oh very good asshole! I suppose you think everyone who opposes you is Phil in disguise!
Taken your paranoid pills today?
RC,
I'm just guessing you are Phil because there aren't very many people who are that stupid.
There are plenty of people as stupid than Phil, John!
How many people have you laid into on this blog?
Why do you think you're having trouble getting your message across? Dumb people make news. Smart people are ignored. That's the way the media works.
Well here is a real flight of reason.
Lucky Phil is the "secret alias" of Phil Gluyas - Timelord.
He does take his wrestling seriously.
Question is does anyone take him seriously? Does he really try for credibility? He is very funny.
Where does the reality end and real life begin with Phil Lewis....I mean Gluyas?
http://www.philsworld.com.au/luckyphil/index.htm
http://www.philsworld.com.au/luckyphil/bio.htm
Phil...."Put a sock in it".....you bloody idiot!
Phil,
You sent links to some junk about wrestling, it's off topic so stop sending it here.
Phil,
You're an idiot. Go away.
I've got severe inattentive-type A.D.D., some of which may also be lupus cognitive dysfunction. One of the most difficult things I've dealt with all my life is an inability to form habits or routines. I also have two grandsons on the autism spectrum.
I think it is dangerous to second-guess other people's diagnoses or self-understanding, even. And a few years ago the University of Maryland was doing research to help mentally ill persons by treating them with...LSD. And if a person has also been treated, perhaps most of the time against her will, with psychiatric drugs...well, what's happened to her brain from that?
People can look at a video of my DGS with HFA and think he's normal. You have to spend time with him daily as I do to know he's got problems, even though he is a lot better than he used to be. And he will give you a lecture on why gluten is bad for you.
I didn't bother to read all the comments. But of the comments I did read, you people are way to damn harsh. Who the hell are you to say that she isn't autistic because she doesn't fit your conception of what autism is? You can't judge someones autism based on a short youtube video. So what if Amanda doesn't act like autistic people you know or have seen. Although I do share some similarities to Amanda, her autism isn't exactly like mine. She is almost totally non verbal, where as I can use verbal speech most of the time. Occasionally I do have to use text to speech software on my PDA or laptop.
Are any of you who question her autism actually autistic? If you aren't autistic then who are you say she isn't autistic. I am firmly convinced that she is, based on the fact that I am autistic. I can relate to her video "in my language" because I do those sorts of things.
But I guess none of this matters. I must not be autistic because I am capeable of using a computer (which I built my self, and istalled the OS' (windows xp and linux) my self) and using the internet. I must also not be autistic because I didn't start flapping and rocking till I was an adult.
I don't fit all the stereotypes of autism, nor does Amanda, nor does any autistic person. So unless you are Autistic or are an expert on autism and know Amanda personal, you are not qualified to say weather or not she is or isn't autistic. Hell, some of these "experts" are not even qualified to say if she is or isn't autistic.
You can't judge someone based on a short youtube video.
Another thing to add. Some people have said that the video looks staged. It is. Somewhere, I don't remember if it was on her blog or youtube, Amanda stated that the video was staged. She staged it because the only she could capture 100% genuine reactions would be to keep her camera on 24/7.
I can totally understand. I have been thinking of doing a video of me stimming set to music. Stimmuing isn't something I can just turn on and off at will. If I try to stim it doesn't feel right and wont look like it does when I usually stim. So the only way to shoot such a video is to keep my video camera handy and turn it on when I happen to be stimming. Although I find I stim more when I am tired. So I could forgo sleep and keep my camera handy.
Before you start to judge based on a video, knowing the background info on the video helps.
Mutant,
I can judge Amanda Baggs because I am an expert in common sense and human decency. As such, I can state, unequivocally, that no sane person could ever oppose curing autism.
That, in and of itself, makes Amanda Baggs a complete fraud. All of the rest, her normalcy into her teens before she scrambled her brain with LSD, is just gravy by which we can probably have her convicted of fraud and send her to jail.
Hi John. I don't think Amanda Baggs is autistic either.
This person might have severe ADD/Cerebral Pares, but not Autism.
I laughed at the LSD comments, 4-5 times a day? The drug lasts for 12 hours, it's not possible to use it that many times in a day, but also because it doesn't have any effect on the brain after the first 12 hours.
Considering his/her/its weight, I can tell it's acting.. You don't get that fat from spending hours trying to find a kettle to boil water in.
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